Lee Winter - The Brutal Truth
For our July meeting of the Lesfic Book Club, we discussed Lee Winter's novel, The Brutal Truth. If you weren't able to make it, check out the transcript below.
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A couple of notes on the transcript:
If you want to join us live, we discuss lesfic novels every month at http://lesficlove.com (sign up or follow me on Twitter to find out what we're reading next). Some chat participants requested that their names be obscured, so below you'll see that everyone has been anonymized as Reader 1, Reader 2, etc
Lee Winter
Hi everyone.
Reader 1
Hello!
Reader 2
Welcome, Lee, thanks for coming!
Reader 5
Hey Lee welcome
Lee Winter
Thanks for asking me
Reader 6
Yay!
Reader 7
Thanks for writing it!
Lee Winter
Lol
Reader 7
That sounded less weird in my head.
Reader 3
Awesome writer person thingy has arrived!
Reader 6
Things always sound less weird in our head @Reader 7
Reader 7
Some of the things in my head sound weird even up there...
Reader 2
So one quick housekeeping note, Lee. We usually end up with a bunch of questions all being asked at once. You can answer them however you want (in the channel or as a thread by hovering over the question and hitting ‘start a thread’) - up to you!
Reader 7
Im gonna stop talking now
Lee Winter
Thanks!
Reader 8
Savage lol
Reader 2
So we can get started whenever you guys are ready. What did you all think of The Brutal Truth?
Reader 6
So damn good
Reader 3
Loved it.
Lee Winter
Meh It was okay
Reader 8
Ridiculously fantastic
Reader 1
Wonderful! I found myself reading longer than I intended, a couple of times, because I was enjoying it and wanting to find out what would happen next!
Reader 3
Didn't love that I forgot all about it until about 4am though and had to rush to read it all before the club meeting.
Reader 6
Seriously, @Lee Winter do you read your own stuff and still find flaws?
Reader 4
Loved it
Reader 3
For some reason I thought I had another week.
Lee Winter
I tend to toss the match on the pyre and walk away once a book is published. I don’t like reading it again
Reader 2
Did you get through it all, @Reader 3?
Reader 3
I did.
Lee Winter
With one exception
Reader 4
The narrator for the audio version was fantastic as well
Reader 5
Its amazing
Lee Winter
Love Angela Dawe
Reader 6
She's a master
Reader 9
What's the exception?
Reader 3
My first question, if Maddie and Elena were mixed drinks, what drinks would they be? And if you want to answer for other characters I would not object.
Lee Winter
Breaking Character. I seem to be in a weird feedback loop on it. Keep rereading it
Reader 8
In a good way?
Lee Winter
Ugh a drinks question for a non drinker. Lol.
Yes in a good way
Maddie would be lemon lime and bitters
I wouldn’t presume to speak for Elena. Hell no
Reader 5
Yum and can totally see that
Probably best not too
Reader 3
I'll just blame Simon for that question.
Lee Winter
Haha
Reader 6
Maybe you keep re-reading it so you can write a sequel. *crosses fingers*
Lee Winter
I have been writing the spinoff at the moment
Reader 4
Lee, Elena seemed to model Miranda Priestly to some extent. Was that your intention?
Reader 7
What was the hardest part of the book to write?
Lee Winter
It was originally a Mirandy fanfic years ago, so yes, I would hope so.
Reader 4
As a reader, I say well done
Reader 6
And as a person that has no clue about all that stuff, I'll say it stands very well on it's own
Reader 5
So three questions from one that can not be here...she wanted to know which character are you most like? Which would you kill? And which would you marry?
Lee Winter
Hardest part... it didn’t really have one. How weird now I think of it
Reader 8
Did you have a favorite line or scene?
Lee Winter
Reader 6 that is awesome to hear. I worked hard to remove its origins from it
Reader 3
What was the hardest part to research?
Lee Winter
Reader 5... most like Maddie, I would kill skeezy Richard, and marry Elena
Favorite scene was in front of the mirror at Australian fashion week when Elena’s gaze is roaming
Reader 8
Yeah...good pick.
Reader 5
Haha agreed
Reader 9
agreed with fav scene
Lee Winter
Hardest parts to research was all things fashion. God I’m useless at it
Reader 6
You faked it well
Lee Winter
Thanks. Lol
Reader 6
Not that I'd know, but they all sounded very fashiony
Lee Winter
I had to learn about things like peplum
Whatevs
Lol
Reader 4
@Reader 6, watch Devil Wears Prada
Reader 5
And another....was the book always meant to have a #metoo aspect to it?
Reader 6
Why, when I have this book? lol
Lee Winter
Metoo... god this is weird. I wrote the book and fanfic of course long before metoo. That hit almost as it was launching
Reader 6
good timing then
Lee Winter
One of the first reviews sneered at that saying well that’s so archaic....and then metoo hit
Lol
Reader 8
I want to say that something I (an ace) appreciate about this book is the emphasis on the "falling," and not focused on the sex.
Reader 2
Agreed, the character development and the romance both went so much further in depth than you typically get and it was great.
Reader 8
Exactly. I was as pulled to them as they were to each other. Their entire journey was an exReader 7ence I wish I could relive again for the very first time.
Reader 1
I also appreciated that when it came to Elena. Some books, the “mean” partner is so overwhelmingly defined by that trait that I can’t see how the other character actually came to love them in the end. Where in Brutal Truth, even when Elena was being mean, I could see and empathize with her, so it was easy to root for them to come together.
Reader 8
Agreed. Because there is so much depth
Reader 5
Nice
Reader 6
archaic? weird...
Lee Winter
Thank you Reader 8
Not everyone sees what they aren’t affected by, Reader 6. So to her it was archaic...until it wasn’t
Reader 3
What is Maddie's favorite thing to cook/bake?
Reader 2
Agreed, the character development and the romance both went so much further in depth than you typically get and it was great.
Reader 5
I love the aspect of falling...its always more the journey to the destination that makes my heart skip
Lee Winter
I think she loves apple crumble things...gooey and sweet
I always prefer the journey to the being in love
Reader 7
In books and in movies, that's what most stories focus on. What made you want to adapt that fanfic into a full novel?
Lee Winter
It had so much love as a fanfic. Like it was my second most popular fic by a long long way. And I couldn’t adapt my most popular (it started with rape ffs), and I really liked Brutal Truth so it just seemed like the thing to do. I wouldn’t do it again though. I hated the people dismissing it because it was a fanfic. May as well just stick to writing other stuff
Reader 4
@Lee Winter, I loved the way you wrote the sex scene.
It felt artful as opposed to slapped on
Reader 8
Do you still write fanfic?
Lee Winter
Thanks Reader 4... I try to have sex scenes as an extension of the story...they tell us more about the people, rather than who is inserting what into whom. :)
Just barely, Reader 8. I have one outstanding from a year ago I keep meaning to finish
Reader 2
Do you work on multiple projects at a time?
READER 10
Forgive me for being late to the club, I'm at work. My question would probably be what has been the hardest part about going from fanfic to full blown novels? Or are they each hard in their own way?
Lee Winter
Nah, one project at a time mainly.
Reader 7
What is your writing process? Not in this specific case. But do you start with the characters, or story, or ?
Actually, in this case, too.
Reader 6
and the eternal plotting vs pantsing.
Lee Winter
Great question READER 10. You have to really step up in quality and standards and editing, and be really on the ball or else it reads like fanfiction and that’s not on since people are paying for it
Reader 7, I am a great plotter who won’t write a word till I have the whole story in my head. I will work out characters, twists, all of it before I write a word.
READER 10
My kingdom to be that organized.
Lee Winter
Haha
Reader 7
Do you chart it? Paper, computer, notecards all over. This stuff is so fascinating.
Reader 11
Where do you gain inspiration for characters and plots?
Reader 6
wow
Lee Winter
Scrivener is a godsend. And yes, I have timelines and charts and everything. Looks like CSI
Reader 6
That type of plotting feels like magic to me. lol
Lee Winter
Inspiration often comes from news stories and wondering what if....
Reader 8
Magic!
Reader 4
@Lee Winter, I understand you’re a journalist, or at least was.
What was it like moving to fiction world?
Reader 6
How did you get so damn good at writing? I've been binging, a you know, and I'm just in awe.
READER 10
Do you ever listen to a conversation and think, "That's going in a book."
Reader 7
Is there something you would change to either the characters or the plot, if you could?
Lee Winter
Reader 4... surreal. It is quite different writing non fiction to flinging myself into a world of fictional lesbians
Reader 6. Journalism. Thirty years of it helps. A lot.
READER 10...more like...that person will be in my book
Reader 6
It's still a leap to write short journalism pieces vs long novels.
Lee Winter
Reader 6 yes it really is. Quire different writing styles too. Fanfic helped me figure it out
Reader 2
What’s your favorite aspect or part of writing a new book?
Lee Winter
Reader 7... no, I don’t think so. I am in a comfy place about Brutal Truth
Reader 7
How long did it take you get to that point? Did you write it and tada? Or did you go back and change things often?
Reader 11
Are you in the process of writing a new book now?
Lee Winter
Reader 2...the excitement of watching them connect. The chemistry of discovering two new people discovering their interest in someone else. It’s like falling in love for me
Reader 12
How do you, personally, feel about brutal honesty?
Lee Winter
About four drafts to get there, Reader 7
Reader 7
Whoa. 4 distinct drafts? How much time was that?
Lee Winter
Reader 12... I live with a gf who is brutally honest. It can be interesting.
Reader 6
So does she read your books, or is that a no go?
Reader 2
And you’re published through Ylva. Do you work heavily with their editors during that part of
the process?
Lee Winter
New book? Yep am on draft five (one more than normal!) of a Breaking Character spinoff called Changing the Script. It’s about director Alex stuck in NZ making the world’s worst movie, Shezan: Mistress of the Forest ... and she keeps thoroughly pissing off the cute local cop
Reader 6
ooooh awesome
Reader 7
Exciting plot!
Lee Winter
Four drafts is about seven months
Reader 11
Can't wait!
Reader 5
Love the plot!
Reader 7
7 months. Wow. That is incredible.
Lee Winter
Reader 2... Next I will get three Ylva editors go through my book.
Reader 4
I remember buying Requiem for Mortals just because I read you’re Aussie.
But, damn, I got hooked on your writing.
Lee Winter
Reader 4 ... maaaate
Reader 6
We have quite a few aussies here
READER 10
do you ever run into...let's say "creative differences" with your editors?
Reader 2
Oh wow, on top of your 4 drafts? No wonder it’s perfection
Reader 7
Whoa. You write 4 or 5 versions. Then the editors get it?
Lee Winter
Reader 2, glad you think so!
Yes Reader 7
Reader 11
Melbourne represent!
Lee Winter
Good question, READER 10. I had a few discussions over one book but I prevailed. See I could see it playing in my head and knew it had to be that way while the editor couldn’t see it. She finally understood and let me keep what I wanted to do there. But most of the time I change stuff when editors make a good case
READER 10
I can understand that. Has anything they've had you change ever drastically altered the course of the book?
Lee Winter
No. Not drastically. Sometimes I’ve been asked to add a scene and usually it value adds to the book
For eg in Requiem I had forgotten to include the exact moment Requiem decides she can’t kill Alison. Kinda important. Editor pointed it out and I added the scene.
READER 10
oh goodness! points for good editor
Reader 6
lol oops
Lee Winter
Yes indeed. The good ones are worth their weight in gold
Reader 2
Do you have a least favorite part of the writing process?
Lee Winter
I hate the editing process. By the time we get there I am SO done with a book I’ve been working on for ages
Reader 3
I am blanking out on the questions today...
READER 10
so you said it usually takes several months to get done with the drafts. Once it finally goes to the editor, how long does it usually take to get to the shelves?
Reader 3
Oh! What is the most exciting part about writing for you?
Or I guess if I rephrased it, what is it about writing that excites you (the most)?
Reader 4
What’s your writing regime?
Set hours? Anytime? Quite place? Music blaring? Etc.
Lee Winter
READER 10 six months. Not because it takes the editors that long but it’s part of a publishing company schedule and lots of other books need attention too, so that’s a rule of thumb
Reader 3...I love it when I fall in love with a protagonist. When I dream about her.
Reader 11
That's so cute.
Lee Winter
Reader 4... every day at my desk at home by eight am, work through to five. If I’m having a hard time writing I will play music that I link to that particular book.
Reader 11
So disciplined!
Reader 2
Ooh cool, do you share your playlists with your readers?
Lee Winter
Well I have bills. :)
I shared the Requiem playlist with readers. It’s on youtube and everything
Reader 2
Nice!
Reader 4
Great list
Reader 3
Who would you say is your favorite protagonist currently?
Lee Winter
Elizabeth Thornton from Breaking Character. Bloody woman got under my skin so bad. I’m trash for her
READER 10
Do particular scenes have particular musical themes, or does an entire book have one set feeling?
Reader 2
And is all of that part of the aforementioned plotting spreadsheets and diagrams?
Lee Winter
The entire book will often have a music vibe. Eg Shattered was Sound of Silence by Disturbed.
Reader 2, no the music either happens or it doesn’t
Reader 9
good song
Reader 4
Back to the 4 drafts, whose input do you use in those? Your only, beta readers, etc.
Lee Winter
Yeah
Me for the first two drafts, beta readers for the third. Sometimes...my brutally honest gf for the fourth, if I’m feeling brave
If you follow me on fb I’ve been posting some of her helpful editing comments. Hilarious and biting
Reader 2
Oh ouch
Lee Winter
I call it the acid and marshmallow edits
Reader 2
Is your girlfriend a creative type (aka do you ever get to serve the acid and marshmallows back the other way)?
Lee Winter
She writes for a hobby, not to share. She’s funny and talented
Reader 2
That reminds me, I was going to ask where you most like to interact with your readers. Facebook then?
Lee Winter
Facebook yes
Reader 4
Better than bad reviews because of bad edits
Lee Winter
Leewinteroz on fb
Reader 6
You are brave.
Lee Winter
Agreed Reader 4
Reader 8
Good question Reader 2.
Lee Winter
Better to be brave than critically panned, Reader 6. :)
Reader 6
True
Reader 2
Who are some of your favorite authors, Lee?
Reader 4
I hate FB
Lee Winter
I am mad for fellow Aussie author Jess Lea. Lola Keeley, British author and famous fanficcer also known as fictorium. Roslyn Sinclair (who wrote the greatest fanfic ever as Telanu) and Alex K. Thorne. But the best descriptive writer I’ve ever read is Fiona Zedde
Reader 3
Have you every written something that has surprised you?
READER 10
tried looking on fb, not finding them
Lee Winter
Brutal Truth surprised me. All those blogs Maddie wrote, Aliens of New York, they weren’t in the fanfic. They turned out surprisingly deep and reflective
Reader 6
And, the style was so different from the rest of the story.
Reader 2
Yes, those were my favorite parts
That and how, well, brutal Elena came off in her first scene
Reader 5
I love the blogs. I think they are my favourite parts of the books
Lee Winter
Thanks. In a way they’re mine in that I didn’t know my brain could do that
Reader 5
Well what an even more beautiful brain
READER 10
Where do you come up with the names for your characters?
Lee Winter
They just come to me. I try them on for size and see if they mentally fit
Reader 3
Is there a question that you are hoping that someone will ask but hasn't been asked yet, and if so then what is it?
Lee Winter
Does this link work? https://www.facebook.com/10001...
facebook.com
Since so many people asked for more of my gf's acid/marshmallow editing notes on my WIP, I've dived into my recycle bin and collected some snark-astic highlights of my book. This also means I get to...
Reader 6
yes
Reader 7
Those are gold.
READER 10
omg those are hilarious
Lee Winter
Back in one minute. Just enjoy the eviscerations of my gf while I’m gone
Reader 2
I imagine having a super snarky editor/beta reader takes some of the sting out of the criticism, that’s great.
Reader 6
these are amazing
Reader 2
Definitely props for letting her do that to a manuscript more than once. I would probably still be crying
READER 10
"You forgot to mention the crows pecked out the other eye" lmao
Reader 7
Some of that snark can’t be fixed with kisses...hm
I love it.
Reader 6
Impressive snark
And now I feel better about editing comments in general. lol
Reader 2
Same!
Lee Winter
Am back. Yes snark on that level requires a thick skin and twenty years together to sail through
Reader 11
Those burns...
Reader 7
Awwww. 20 years?! Congrats. Yea. At that point you know the love is there...regardless
Reader 6
It definitely helps
Lee Winter
It’s true. I don’t recommend this level of scathing for new couples
Reader 2
Haha yeah that could stop a new relationship in its tracks
READER 10
What was your reaction the first time the acid came out?
Lee Winter
She’s always been like this. She believes in the brutal truth in all things. Sound familiar?
Reader 5
No wonder you named a novel that?!
Lee Winter
It seemed apt
Reader 2
Fascinating - I’ve always liked the abstract concept of radical honesty but it seemed like fiction
Reader 12
No wonder you said you're like Maddie and would marry Elena
Reader 2
I’m sure when she gives you a compliment it’s the best feeling in the world
Lee Winter
True, Elle. And Reader 2 it’s like gold dust. Rare and precious
Reader 7
awwww
Reader 5
Even better!
Reader 4
Do you have “long term” list of books to write?
Lee Winter
I realise now I have always grown up in a blunt family so hearing brutal truths was not unusual for me. It didn’t bother me finding a love like this
Reader 5
Which book is your favorite that you wrote so far?
READER 10
What advice would you give for those of us who are thinking of publishing for the first time?
for the aspiring authors in the group, I should say
Lee Winter
Fave book is a tie ... Requiem and Breaking Character
Reader 5
Why those two??
Lee Winter
Reader 4 I have a few ideas longterm bumping around I’d like to get to one day.
READER 10
I swear I know how to type, yall
Lee Winter
Requiem...dark and different, it absorbed me. Breaking Character...structurally it’s my best written book, and Thornton owns my bloody ovaries, damned woman
Reader 6
lol
Lee Winter
Advice for writers...get better with fanfic. If you’re interested in specifics I wrote a blog about this once
Reader 7
Please
Reader 5
Love that! Lol
Reader 2
We are a little past the top of the hour, don’t want to hold Lee up from starting her day so does anyone else have questions they haven’t gotten to ask yet? Speak now or forever hold your peace
Lee Winter
Ylva Publishing
From Fanfic to Lesfic Author—8 Steps to Get You Published - Ylva Publishing
From fanfiction to lesbian fiction author – Lee Winter gives 8 tips and tricks to help fanfiction writers get published.
Sep 10th, 2017
Reader 3
Do you have anything you'd want to tell writers to avoid doing?
Lee Winter
For the love of all things holy avoid head-hopping POVs in the same scene. Just get that right and your writing will be so much better
Reader 11
Yes. Please stop dressing characters in Capri pants.
Lee Winter
That means we aren’t in two people’s thoughts in the same scene
In my getting published blog above there’s a link to pet peeves... funny stuff
Reader 11
Do you have a favourite book overall (not necessarily lesfic)?
Lee Winter
It changes, so I don’t think so. Last year it was A Curious Woman by Jess Lea. But it’ll be different again in another six months
Reader 5
Lol mine changes a lot too, a new one keeps coming out and topping my last favourite book.
Reader 2
Which is a great problem to have haha
Well, thank you so much for joining us, Lee!
Lee Winter
No problem
Reader 2
Your trophy for withstanding the barrage of questions is in the mail
Lee Winter
Woot!
If anyone wan